A "breathing" frame house

[Summer]

Dear, colleagues, the question of a novice builder.
On the forum is considered a sufficiently large number of options for the walls of frame houses. Most of these options are reduced to the use of steam, moisture, wind-isolation, which makes the house like a "plastic bag". Is it possible to organize the construction of the walls of a frame house so that it will be "breathing", provided that the house is not scheduled to live during the winter?

[bill]

A breathable frame house):-)??
Do not think for work, give an example, if you can name the materials?

[constructor]

Hmm. I don’t want to make an ad ...But .. for example, the technology of framework called “Skanditek” - an article on the site "Vash.Dom" -http://www.vashdom.ru/articles/skanditek_1.htm
In Moscow there is a representative company. This concept is similar in Finland - the technology called “Ekoreks” (the company called “Rantasalmi”), in Russia it is sold through the company "Manor".
Another "breathing" frame houses provided by (in St. Petersburg, in Ekaterigburg), the company "Nord-plus," "Drevkot" (in St Petersburg, http://www.drevco.ru).
The basis for the “breathable” house is a corresponding insulation. Not a very large number of heaters meet the necessary requirements. This fiber (such as “Steico flex”, “zell” - http://www.steico.de), a polyurethane filler “Demilek”, “Penoizol”, a foam, an ecowool, plates called ‘Vital”, “Homatherm”. I am a supporter of a cellulose fibre and wood fibers, but the advocates of other materials, there are also arguments.
The information for the device frame can be found in my pamphlet on the site - http://www.ecowool.ru/04-2-wkark.php
Acceptable solutions are actually quite few, the brochure gives only a general trend.

[baltazar]

And in case of the device “pie” (from the premises to the street) a vapor barrier / insulation paroc/OSB-3/ the wind protection - it would be a "breathing" “pie”?

[expert]

Well, if you have a vapor barrier, then how the "pie" will "breathe"?. And what kind of finish will be inside?
And why you want to have the wind insulation?

[buldozer]

On the OSB-3 builders offer “TYVEK HOUSEWRAP”, I was said that it will be better, an additional wind and hydro-protection, and for the exterior trimming is a siding? You do not need to do it?.

[expert]

Have you ever tried talking with the owners of frame homes by the presence of polyethylene bag feelings?. All this is completely unfounded. There is no special feeling. Especially, if the trimmed wood inside. Dry, warm (or cool, depending on a season), a pine smell. I know a lot of frame houses (including mine) and I do not know any claims. I am willing to bet that if a person is settled in a frame house and a clean wooden house, not to mention where he is living, he wouldn’t feel the difference. And he will say that it will be comfortable in a frame house.

[Summer]

I'm confused. a vapor barrier is needed before the insulation?.

[buldozer]

I am not specialist, but there are a number of conclusions ...
1. On the use of OSB as an external cladding of the frame we spoke a lot .. but a lot of people build so ... A little time has passed, to see whether do it or not, look up at themes of OSB, may be you will have a clearer meaning.
2. To use extra tape you, it will not be worse. Note that the back plate there is a good wind screen. If there is no moisture on it, I would not istall it...
A vapor barrier must protect the insulation from penetration of the vapor inside the house.

[constructor]

I tried it, it is praised by everybody, so I am studying this section. As for the reviews of the frame house owners, I strongly doubt that the owner will strongly criticize his house, which he built by his own hands, and which he continue to live in.
Maybe that's the stereotype about the "bag", but purely psychological to construct a greenhouse instead of home it is not very desirable.

[buldozer]

A “breathing” home does not exist.
There are walls that take on a moisture and give it without no problems (a condensation), none house can not breathe by understanding of the air- the ventilation is necessary everywhere.
Now, we live in a panel house, it was everything good until we put plastic windows - no longer the house stoped "breathing" ... the walls blackened in the corners and drops of water were formed (I redo another room – a high humidity).

[bill]

I understand it, but you should realize that you will live not psychologically, but really. For psychological problems there are doctors. And really, a frame house on a comfort yield to somebody regardless of fairy tales about "breathing" houses. Note, I'm not talking about the theory, but about the practice.

[constructor]

The question of the “breathing” walls has been discussed many times and everybody understands this of his own.
Maybe, we will discuss here – what is really behind this muddy concept?.
Well, let's say why in the concept of a "breathing" frame house not to deploy the "myths and realities" of breathing walls. (And the applicability of this concept to skeletons).
As I understand it, a "breathing wall" - this is not kind of miracle, where there is a natural ventilation due to some "breathing" while retaining of heat. This is a wall which is designed to divert the excess humidity in maintaining an optimal climate for human rights. That is a breathable wall in no way cancels the ventilation.
In order to be breathing wall
1) a lack of a vapor barrier.
2) use of materials with high vapor penetration, but suffering due to the presence of moisture (a steam condensate) in its structure.
3) application of the rule to increase a vapor permeability of materials to the direction outward from inside the house.
Other opinions?

[baltazar]

I have already done for a month finishing of a frame house, the total area is 160 sq. m. Honestly, I was afraid of a "thermos", but that was in vain. An electric boiler works for a month, and it is warm, comfortable and not stuffy!!.

[expert]

I am willing to argue - that the difference is great!. Do not settle me, I live here. In a “breathing”… The house is insulated by an ecowool without a vapor barrier. And I have stayed for two days in a vapor barrier “bag”.
Well, you don’t no need to mislead the people. Did you live in that?. Wait until the moisture absorbs..

[Summer]

Your are completely right!. Moscow is working intermittently. But the theme of breathing walls have occurred so many times that it seems to me - it's time to finally deal with this issue!!.

[buldozer]

It's not a house that stopped “breathing”, but a "forced ventilation" wasn’t no more. Open the windows for the "winter ventilation." It should be in your new windows. Don’t you have a fixed kitchen hood?. Or it doesn’t work for some reason?.

[buldozer]

There is)).
But I am afraid that the "myths" don’t interested you).
You're a theorist).
I calculated the airflow of logs .. And there are figures on this forum somewhere..
Yes, I calculated a little about four times a day, the log cabin changes the air flow .. Through the ends ..
I have enough for a full comfort .. Without any ventilation ..
In a plastic bag (read a frame house with a vapor barrier) – In a couple of hours I was choking .. There is one point - I was comparing, I have never lived in a frame polyethylene house. If there is nothing to compare, I'm sure I would have praised my plastic bath) with the open windows)).
Well, and most importantly - you have said correctly - the log has its property that all physicians appreciate the overriding condition for a sustaining human life - the optimum moisture content. ..
I'm not an insider of ecowool, I just use it .. Insiders don’t lie).
And here I would advise one thing – to tell the people the cost of equipment to maintain an optimum moisture content for a human ..
If you don’t know the question, add the questions, and wait for experts).
But we have understood for a long time, the forum should be read from the end and not from the beginning).
The opinions of people were just listed that lived in the wooden houses)/
Damn, the reformers).

[constructor]

I could not resist!. Again, we are starting this nonsense about the "breathing" walls ... "The air of logs" - this is hard!. Four times a day!/ through the logs -??? a whisper - Maybe it is through the holes between the logs?. It would be interesting to get acquainted with the theoretical justifications for such bold conclusions.

[expert]

Wooden (out of round logs and timbers) and thatched houses have an air permeability. In this case the walls act as a heat exchanger. The counter-flows (infiltrated) exchange a heat and a moisture vapor and a heat loss from the building is partially compensated. It turns out that the wooden or thatched wall actually has a high thermal resistance, compared with the calculated data.
Here is "NO". Everything is true, when the air pressure on the walls in the house is the same. Otherwise, one wall passes more inside the wall (a wall is cooling down), and another wall is passes more outside (a heat and a moisture are out). This happens, for example, when the wind blows.
To avoid this undesirable phenomenon we must balance the air pressure on all the walls. A possible option is to make a windproof (an airtight) upgraded ventilated facade. In other words, the air should flow into ventilated areas only from one location, for example, from the top (from the attic or a ventilation shaht). There are no other suctions. Then the air pressure around the perimeter of the house will be the same, and the wooden walls will act as a heat exchanger-recuperator.
http://www.winews.ru/cgi-bin/printpage.pl?printid=238. Here is a comparative table of measurements of concentration of a harmful substance in the homes from different materials. Sorry, there is no frame, because the insulation is so various that they should have been separately each. In this case it is clear that the smallest value of the concentration of harmful substances is observed in houses that made of wood, due to the porous structure and a good air exchange.